Furthermore: why has the Shift Modifier be pressed to get the lasso tool when clicking in the timeline? I think from a UX perspective, unless there is a “more important function” available without a modifier, the selection could be initiated without pressing Shift. Selections without pressing a modifier key are not possible atm, i dont see the reason why.
Because clicking and ‘dragging’ in the timeline scrubs the playback cursor?
That seems like a far more commonly used and ‘important’ function than group selection. And shift-click is already used to add individual item to the selected group, so it’s always seemed pretty intuitive to me.
The only gripe I’ve ever had with this is that the area selection clears the existing selection group and starts a new one instead of also just adding to it. Occasionally it would be nice to make a group selection with multiple areas.
I dont see a particular reason why clicking and dragging in the timeline AND the ruler should both trigger the same functionality - scrubbing. Clicking on the Ruler could start a selection, clicking on the timeline could cause scrubbing (unless Shift is pressed, to start a selection, like it is now)
Hmm, interesting thought. The funny thing is that I would associate clicking on the ruler (and dragging) with scrubbing (the ruler is the timeline after all, right?), and clicking (and dragging) anywhere in the tracks with starting a selection.
In addition, a click in the track(s) in a clip selects that clip, whereas Shift+click (and subsequent drag) would start the selection of many clips even if the Shift+click was done on a clip.
TL;DR: I think the current setup that clicking/dragging in the timeline ruler or empty space in the tracks is for scrubbing, and Shift+clicking/dragging is for selecting multiple clips works perfectly and is actually quite intuitive. YMMV.
I think that way would be perfectly fine as well, only that it needs to be clicking into an “empty” area of the timeline. I just feel that being forced to use two hands, press a modifier to get the selection tool aka lasso, is not efficient. It is one of the most used “actions” in editing and it could be done conentiently by mouse (and one hand) with a simple and unintrusive UI change.
There’s also the zone marker between them, which is already a fairly small target, and having different consequences depending on which side you miss it on isn’t the least confusing thing that could happen.
Scrubbing and moving the cursor is an operation so core to editing that it warrants a large and unambiguous target area to be the default action in.
and that is also something that won’t always be present around the things you want included in a group defined by a rectangular area, just like them not being directly adjacent to the ruler, so now you’d need a special case to handle that too.
I find that claim interesting, as it’s not at all my experience (without at all denying you yours and your habits) …
Do you know that you can persistently group clips that you’re doing this a lot with - and that if you’re regularly wanting to move clips on all or most tracks below the ruler there is the spacer tool (possibly in conjunction with locking some tracks)?
I guess most of the time I need this, my non-mouse hand is already hovering over jkl and/or io/IO, so stabbing shift as an extra mouse button isn’t an onerous barrier to selecting a group (among the many other things there’s a keyboard shortcut for that needs shift). So I am curious now what you’re doing that I’ve not learned to do which makes this seem “inefficient”?
Agreed, but you can also use the ruler in the project monitor. For me, the timeline ruler is large enough to hit it easily with the mouse. Besides, in most projects tracks are pretty much filled up with clips and very little space to start a scrubbing action (see your other comment why a selection should be possible to be started in the timeline ruler with Shift+drag ), so I wouldn’t want to try that for fear of grabbing a clip and moving it by accident.
So, with my hands being on the keyboard for other shortcuts (e.g. JKL) using my pinky to hold the Shift key while moving the mouse around is not adding that much of extra dexterous work to get the job done. But you said that already …
ah, that’s an interesting point (and exactly why I’m usually curious about the real source of some itch I’m not really feeling) - my “worst case number of tracks needed” is almost always, and sometimes significantly, greater than the number needed for the bulk of the ‘normal editing’ portions - and for my use I usually still prefer using “traditional” transitions to the same track mixes (they’re just faster and easier to use when you’re not sure exactly how long you’ll want the transition to be until a later phase in editing, and not always end trimming source clips) - so I’ve almost always got plenty of open space (especially relative to what my tiny fonts give me in the ruler).
I rarely find myself using the monitor ruler, except occasionally to seek roughly to the cut points of a clip that I’ve split into several pieces on the timeline - partly because it’s “too tiny”, but mostly because it’s also usually “too coarse” for a timeline I’m zoomed in on. But I’ve also only recently added another (physical) monitor for editing - and I’m not quite sure yet how my habits might change with the project monitor running full-screen outside the main window.
So yes, this is definitely another of those More Than One Way things to navigate
Of course, YMMV, and it depends on the zoom level.
What I am trying to say is that Kdenlive offers a lot of flexibility to accommodate many different editing styles, workflows, editing habits (good or bad), muscle memory, monitor setups, font sizes, themes, etc etc etc - ad nauseam. There is no one way of doing something or accomplishing a task.
), so I wouldn’t want to try that for fear of grabbing a clip and moving it by accident.